Timeline for Recourse against bank ATM fraud in China
Current License: CC BY-SA 4.0
18 events
| when toggle format | what | by | license | comment | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Jan 13, 2020 at 0:55 | comment | added | Loren Pechtel | @Fattie We have some ATMs here with multiple cassettes of the same denomination--for a high volume ATM it reduces the servicing interval. | |
| Jan 12, 2020 at 15:52 | comment | added | Fattie | @LorenPechtel , my company has only done limited work on ATM-related software. So I can't give you an absolutely definitive answer. But it is incredibly far-fetched. "theoretically possible" has literally no meaning. For example, it is (totally) "theoretically possible" that a human is behind an actually hollowed-out ATM and shoving out notes. | |
| Jan 10, 2020 at 23:55 | answer | added | Cody | timeline score: 5 | |
| Jan 10, 2020 at 23:00 | comment | added | Loren Pechtel | @Fattie Most machines have multiple cassettes of money--usually one per denomination but it doesn't have to be. It would be theoretically possible for the ATM to be programmed to dispense 100s from cassette A to foreigners and 100s from cassette B to locals. | |
| Jan 10, 2020 at 17:43 | comment | added | theonetruepath | @NateEldredge I also state that the bank's position is that they are not responsible for the operation of the ATMs. They also said that they are never in a position to access their innards. It's clear to me that the ATM operating company is directly at fault here, and the bank is at fault for allowing this to persist given that the ATMs are branded by the bank. "Come and use our nice ATMs. Oh it stole your money, well it's not our fault we don't operate them" | |
| Jan 10, 2020 at 16:14 | comment | added | VGR | Possibly relevant in terms of culture: german.stackexchange.com/questions/52937/… | |
| Jan 10, 2020 at 15:00 | history | tweeted | twitter.com/StackTravel/status/1215649703859302401 | ||
| Jan 10, 2020 at 14:59 | comment | added | puppetsock | Your credit card company is probably the place to ask if you can get money back from your credit card company. | |
| Jan 10, 2020 at 14:30 | comment | added | Fattie | @theonetruepath - thanks for sharing this story, amazing! Just one small point, there'd be no technical way for the ATM to dispense from a "fake batch" or a "real batch" at will (well, it would be a utterly different ATM engineering pipeline; I guess not impossible!) thanks again! | |
| Jan 10, 2020 at 9:57 | comment | added | Aaron F | "in any other country, something like this happening regularly would be detected and stamped out very quickly" - would it? It doesn't cost the banks anything to ignore the problem, but would cost them a lot to reimburse everyone affected. How would they be able to distinguish real victims from counterfeiters? Cash also costs them a lot of money to deal with, and fewer people will use cash if there's a higher risk of counterfeit notes, so there's not much incentive to solve the problem. | |
| Jan 10, 2020 at 9:49 | comment | added | Aaron F | This isn't unique to China. It happens all over the world. I was once given a fake €50 note in Spain. The bank said I couldn't prove that I had withdrawn that note from their machine. Now I count my cash in front of the cash machine's camera in an attempt to have some evidence. | |
| Jan 10, 2020 at 9:39 | history | became hot network question | |||
| Jan 10, 2020 at 5:34 | comment | added | Matt Douhan | @theonetruepath China is not a normal country, one of the big issues here is corruption and fraud, I estimate it will take another 50 years before they reach acceptable standards, also note that many Chinese people think fraud is ok, it’s almost as if you have to cheat to get ahead, the new president is trying to stifle this but it will take time | |
| Jan 10, 2020 at 4:37 | comment | added | theonetruepath | Furthermore, I would say that in any other country, something like this happening regularly would be detected and stamped out very quickly. For this to continue for many years (according to travel forums) means that a culture of permitting it exists. I don't know whether this culture penetrates into the bank, but I know they are aware of it and are either unable or unwilling to fix it. And I can't see how they would be unable year upon year to fix this. A simple phone call to the ATM managing company: "We have had 2300 ATM frauds from your ATMs in the last month. Fix it today." | |
| Jan 10, 2020 at 4:32 | comment | added | theonetruepath | No I would say not the bank policy, not my assumption at all. Almost certainly someone in the ATM-managing company. But more to the point, some group of people relativelyhigh up in that company, able to influence programming of that ATM. Because the notes are photographed (just the serial numbers) as they leave the machine. And bank employees are able to see those photos, and were able to show me photos of real serial numbers (which were not the ones I received). So my assumption is that significant control over the ATM is required to accomplish that, probably well beyond an individual. | |
| Jan 10, 2020 at 1:32 | answer | added | Matt Douhan | timeline score: 31 | |
| Jan 10, 2020 at 1:30 | review | First posts | |||
| Jan 10, 2020 at 4:21 | |||||
| Jan 10, 2020 at 1:26 | history | asked | theonetruepath | CC BY-SA 4.0 |